Comments on: We’ll know Apex is Real if AppExchange starts making money for partners http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/2006/10/13/well-know-apex-is-real-if-appexchange-starts-making-money-for-partners/ An industry analyst blog looking at software ecosystems and convergence Fri, 03 Feb 2012 10:35:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Craig Cmehil http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/2006/10/13/well-know-apex-is-real-if-appexchange-starts-making-money-for-partners/comment-page-1/#comment-1944 Craig Cmehil Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:22:17 +0000 http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/wp/?p=750#comment-1944 Those "interesting projects" are turning up more and more as developers begin to use core functions within SAP system in a scope not really thought of before. The idea you can take a basic ABAP class file turn it into a simple web service using REST and passing data to 3rd Party apps or receiving data into your SAP system and passing it around your landscape thanks to trusted system setups while securing your environment from harmful code is really start to evolve and some very sweet apps are starting to pop up. Tie those into robust scripting languages like Ruby on Rails (framework, it's a framework I know but hey come on stay with me here) and PHP and there seems to be little in terms of limitations on what can be done. Food for thought! Craig Those “interesting projects” are turning up more and more as developers begin to use core functions within SAP system in a scope not really thought of before. The idea you can take a basic ABAP class file turn it into a simple web service using REST and passing data to 3rd Party apps or receiving data into your SAP system and passing it around your landscape thanks to trusted system setups while securing your environment from harmful code is really start to evolve and some very sweet apps are starting to pop up. Tie those into robust scripting languages like Ruby on Rails (framework, it’s a framework I know but hey come on stay with me here) and PHP and there seems to be little in terms of limitations on what can be done.

Food for thought!

Craig

]]> By: Anne http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/2006/10/13/well-know-apex-is-real-if-appexchange-starts-making-money-for-partners/comment-page-1/#comment-1943 Anne Tue, 17 Oct 2006 01:05:20 +0000 http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/wp/?p=750#comment-1943 Likely the reason they chose a statically typed, compiled language is not because of the safety but because of convenience. Essentially they're offering up the ability to put stored procedures onto their host, into their database. The easiest way to do that is with something PL/SQL like. That's the language of Oracle stored procedures, and Salesforce.com apparently uses Oracle RDBMS. Then, not wanting to call it PL/SQL-like--how dull--they called it java-like because with PL/SQL object extensions, java and PL/SQL are not too dissimilar. Maybe stored procedures are what a developer would want and need, if they were going to build a from-scratch enterprise-scale app on the salesforce infrastructure. However, I suspect most developers aren't going to do that. They'll extend and customize salesforce itself, which may or may not require the performance, safety, and transaction control of a database stored procedure language. Scripts stored on the middle tier might be sufficient. At any rate, the interesting thing is not the details of their "on-demand" language but rather the possibility of creating an app marketplace. I can't see how Salesforce will grow beyond the CRM space given that's where their dollars come from. Any real investment outside of that might get distorted or swamped by the core business thrust towards gaining and satisfying the CRM customers. But if they do succeed in creating a marketplace--wouldn't that be exciting. Likely the reason they chose a statically typed, compiled language is not because of the safety but because of convenience. Essentially they’re offering up the ability to put stored procedures onto their host, into their database. The easiest way to do that is with something PL/SQL like. That’s the language of Oracle stored procedures, and Salesforce.com apparently uses Oracle RDBMS. Then, not wanting to call it PL/SQL-like–how dull–they called it java-like because with PL/SQL object extensions, java and PL/SQL are not too dissimilar.

Maybe stored procedures are what a developer would want and need, if they were going to build a from-scratch enterprise-scale app on the salesforce infrastructure. However, I suspect most developers aren’t going to do that. They’ll extend and customize salesforce itself, which may or may not require the performance, safety, and transaction control of a database stored procedure language. Scripts stored on the middle tier might be sufficient.

At any rate, the interesting thing is not the details of their “on-demand” language but rather the possibility of creating an app marketplace. I can’t see how Salesforce will grow beyond the CRM space given that’s where their dollars come from. Any real investment outside of that might get distorted or swamped by the core business thrust towards gaining and satisfying the CRM customers. But if they do succeed in creating a marketplace–wouldn’t that be exciting.

]]> By: Thomas Otter http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/2006/10/13/well-know-apex-is-real-if-appexchange-starts-making-money-for-partners/comment-page-1/#comment-1942 Thomas Otter Tue, 17 Oct 2006 01:02:35 +0000 http://www.redmonk.com/jgovernor/wp/?p=750#comment-1942 James, I'm up for a rematch at pool anytime, although perhaps we should play doubles against all comers. Actually a bloggers pool tournament for charity might get more takers than the cycling did...one to ponder on. I'm not sure that I said that scripting languages are brittle. My point about the JCL example was not on the scripting language flexibility or otherwise (the JCL just kicked off the various programmes and helped merge 7 rather large flat files I'm remembering more about this than I really wanted to), but about how difficult it is to predict points of failure. Unintended consequences abound. The series of extracts and date updates that I wrote in an SQL scripting tool were tested numerous times (not just by me), went through a major signoff process and I still nearly managed to crash the production system, because of a minor error. If SDFC think that they can deliver an environment where everyone's script runs in perfect harmony, in a production environment, then brill. No-one else has ever come close. So I was expecting more folks to question this than did I'm not an expert in programming languages, but the irony of SAP constantly being battered about the proprietary nature of ABAP isn't lost on me. I have a lot of respect for SFDC, as you'll see in my posts. They grew when the C1's of this world were dying, so respect is due. But I think it is tough to build world class business applications, it is tough to build great tools, it is tough to build world class hosted service 24/7, it is damn tough to entice others to a platform or market and profit from it. To do all of these simultaneously on the R&D budget of sfdc would be in the realm of fishes and bread and 5000 hungry developers. James,
I’m up for a rematch at pool anytime, although perhaps we should play doubles against all comers. Actually a bloggers pool tournament for charity might get more takers than the cycling did…one to ponder on.

I’m not sure that I said that scripting languages are brittle.

My point about the JCL example was not on the scripting language flexibility or otherwise (the JCL just kicked off the various programmes and helped merge 7 rather large flat files I’m remembering more about this than I really wanted to), but about how difficult it is to predict points of failure. Unintended consequences abound.

The series of extracts and date updates that I wrote in an SQL scripting tool were tested numerous times (not just by me), went through a major signoff process and I still nearly managed to crash the production system, because of a minor error.

If SDFC think that they can deliver an environment where everyone’s script runs in perfect harmony, in a production environment, then brill. No-one else has ever come close. So I was expecting more folks to question this than did

I’m not an expert in programming languages, but the irony of SAP constantly being battered about the proprietary nature of ABAP isn’t lost on me.

I have a lot of respect for SFDC, as you’ll see in my posts. They grew when the C1′s of this world were dying, so respect is due.

But I think it is tough to build world class business applications, it is tough to build great tools, it is tough to build world class hosted service 24/7, it is damn tough to entice others to a platform or market and profit from it.

To do all of these simultaneously on the R&D budget of sfdc would be in the realm of fishes and bread and 5000 hungry developers.

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